Talk:Metropolis (manga)

Sequel?

Will there be a (novel, manga, movie, tv) sequel to Metropolis? The movie was left open-ended. -- John-1107V Ed Telerionus 02:18, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

It's called a slingshot ending (which I thought was a term borrowed from Gene Wolfe, but apparently was coined by Kim Stanley Robinson) - and I think the openness of it is part of the excellence. --zippedmartin 12:39, 18 May 2005 (UTC)

When Tima turns to evil by the effects of her command CPU and Ziggurat throne, i would call her Nereius, Dark Lord of the Ziggurat of Metropolis who is the human form of a Skynet-type supercomputer. I heard in the movie that one of Metropolis's high-ranking military officers mentioned that one of Metropolis's enemy nations is developing a weapon of mass destruction; does this mean that there's going to be a sequel with Metropolis's enemy as the main villain? -- JohnVEd Telerionus 23:38, 20 May 2005 (UTC)

I'm afraid Metropolis will NOT have a sequel. At all. The movie was based on Osamu Tezuka's manga from 1949, and that work was self contained. It was one of three pieces that tied together including Lost World and Next World. It is extremely notable for its story and introduction of Duke Red to Osamu Tezuka's Star System, but in actuality, the movie and manga story are actually QUITE different while still being similar too. Regardless, the movie is quite the masterpiece.

OtakuMan 16:27, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Image

We need images on this article! -- John VEd Telerionus 21:12, 19 May 2005 (UTC)

Based on what?

This article claims that the anime film was not based on the '27 movie, though several sources here in Wikipedia referring to the movie say the anime was based on it. Whichever version is true it ought to be standardized.

Well, there should be a poster and some screenshots on this article. I know that the anime movie was based on Osamu Tezuka's manga, but i know that the movie storyline was similar to the 1927 film in which Tezuka claimed he received inspiration for his manga version of Metropolis by seeing the poster of the 1927 film. --206.255.32.51 01:22, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Truth be told, Tezuka NEVER saw the Fritz Lang version of Metropolis. ONLY THE POSTER for it! It was from looking at the poster that Tezuka got the idea for doing his version. All he had to go on was the female in the poster and the name. The rest was all him. I'll be sure to fix and properly reference that soon.

OtakuMan 16:28, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Clarity

am I the only one who finds the summary to be rather painfully incoherent and rambling?

Date clarification

"The movie also has the honour of being the first anime movie since the mid 90's to be aired on Channel 4 in the UK (It aired in the early hours of Sunday 30th October and was aired both uncut and in Japanese with english Subtitles)."

What year? --Daniel Lawrence 22:51, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Tezuka's Manga vs. Fritz Lang's '27 film vs. this edition

Maybe this should be its own section. Allow me to share how I learned the difference between these versions: When I first saw this film adaptation in theaters I had only seen the Fritz Lang film. I was impressed by the reinterpretation of many themes from the '27 film, and I was curious to track down Tezuka's original manga to see how it was originally adapted. In the meantime I purchased the DVD and watched the commentary (where I learned that Tezuka did not want the manga adapted because he considered it a lesser work he was not satisfied with). What struck me about the commentary is that, not once did the filmmakers of this version ever cite the Fritz Lang film (despite the clear influences). Besides finding that tasteless, it reinforced my interest in tracking down an English translation of the Tezuka manga. I finally found one in 2003, and I was surprised to see that the original manga barely resembles the '27 movie and was seriously changed for this film adaptation. That's not to say that Tezuka's was inferior, rather that the story was different in many key areas from both film versions. Tezuka clearly aimed the story at younger readers: it removes all the complex elements of social struggle, includes much more slapstick antics, and even has a sequence where multiple, evil copies of Mickey Mouse (they do not merely resemble Mickey, they are actual replicas) attack the protagonists. As is noted in the article, Tezuka claims to have never seen the '27 film and merely based his version off of the posters. It should also be briefly noted that the manga includes a very troubling depiction of black people in the Metropolis in the early scenes (something that virtually all Japanese drawings did at the time, and is the subject of a preface in the Dark Horse edition). While this story, using Tezuka's style of uncomplex artwork, worked as manga aimed at younger audiences, the film version was seriously rewritten to appeal to older audiences. It reintroduced a strong theme of class struggle in the Metropolis and applied that to the robot class as well. The art also became far more industrialized, showing a shining upper city and an ugly, forgotten lower city. Both of these elements, thematic and artistic, are obviously drawn back from the '27 Fritz Lang film. After expecting Tezuka's version to clearly be the source for the '01 adaptation, I can say, without hesitation, that the 2001 film in this article is almost evenly inspired by Tezuka's manga and Lang's film. Anyway, I found it easier to write this POV here than try and create a new section in the limited time I have Bobak 18:36, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps the articles should be separated, to promote more being written about the manga. What is written about the manga is terribly sparse.

Wrong article title ?

This article is actualy titled "Metropolis (manga)" but there few things about the manga (not even the 1949 release date) and a lot of informations on the anime (the right hand movie description box with the DVD cover for exemple) This article should be re-title "Metropolis (anime)" and an article "Metropolis (manga)" should be created from scratch.

Lacrymocéphale

I think a better idea would be to create the page for Metropolis (anime) and then just move all the information that relates to the anime from here to there. Then, the manga section can be padded out with more information. I'm going to take it upon myself to fix this glaring error.

OtakuMan 16:18, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

The candle-trivia (anime)

Is it necessary to include this trivia at all? If so can somebody verify this: "This is a reference to Tezuka's various manga; the same character appears in different roles in several of Tezuka's other stories. It is a running joke (based on his name) that extreme emotion sometimes causes him to sprout a candle from the back of his head." [1] Masken 18:20, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

That's actually not true. The candle is because that character is really Acetylene Lamp, one of Osamu Tezuka's many characters in his Star System. I can fix that by making a cast list. But the candle sprouting is actually 100% false.

OtakuMan 16:21, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

A "Cast" in a manga?

I believe it's quite bizzare to refer to fictional comic characters play "as themselves" in a manga as if they were real people. Perhaps this was copied off somewhere, or maybe this was merely for the sake of Shunsaku Ban as "Detective Higeoyaji" and the other red links, but I'm going to change the heading into Characters and delete the "this person as him/herself" references and red link characters except the aforementioned example. --JDitto 00:47, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Bizarre, maybe. But it's TRUE! Osamu Tezuka used various characters in multiple manga. He called it his star system. These characters each had their own personalities and physical features that played a major role in his work. While the character pages have not been made yet, I've been working on expanding coverage of his work at a near exponential rate. First his manga, then his anime, and finally his characters.

Before you go making assumptions, perhaps you should read a bit more about Osamu Tezuka and his work first! Please do not undo what I contributed. Thank you.

OtakuMan 01:04, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Tezuka had a bunch of character designs he used again and again. He explained it as actors playing different roles.

Take the character design of Rokuro. The design appears in Captain Ken, Black Jack and Metropolis but the character and name are not always the same.

Tezuka would say Rokuro played "Mamoru" in Captain Ken, he played the "Duke's son" in Metropolis (anime) and he played the character of "Rock" in the new Black Jack movie.

I know it might seem cool, --hey, I think it is-- but articles must be written in an out-of-universe perspective. Meaning you can't treat characters as if they are real people, or actors. So no "Mitchy as Herself" or "Makeru Butamo as 'Dr. Charles Lawton'." Sorry.

You could get around it by wikilinking this way: Detective Higeoyaji. Just a thought.--Nohansen 11:03, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

I can see your point with the treating characters out-of-universe style, but as said, this is what Tezuka himself would have said when describing his characters in his manga. By putting the name of the character in front of the role that they play, I feel like I am distinguising who plays who, and helping to reinforce the Star System.

The tricky part now is that I have been using that as a kind of template for all the Tezuka pages that I have made, and if possible, I would hate to have to go back to all of them and change them. If for the sake of ensuring an out-of-universe perspective, then I will consent to re-editing the character pages on the condition that, wherever possible, I can Wiki-Link to the character's Star System page. I know many of them still need to be created, but once I cover all of his manga, I think I'll be ready to work on that. Then I'll fill in the gaps for his anime.

I'm still not convinced that the way I'm doing it now is necessarily too in-universe. I think maybe a vote or some kind of consensus needs to be taken to determine whether it is or is not too in-universe. If there's enough of a feeling towards that way, then I will fix it. If not, I say leave it be.

OtakuMan 13:50, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

As you've said, articles on Tezuka's works are sorely lacking in quality. The reason: not many people care. In fact, I'd find it hard meeting quorum for a Tezuka WP:TASKFORCE, where this discussion should take place. In short, achieving concensus might be tricky.

I recommend you work on Osamu Tezuka's Star System to make it as comprehensive as possible, with images and details on the character's appearances. Write the article character sections as WP:WAF establishes, (meaning, no "Shunsaku Ban as 'Detective Higeoyaji'") but with a Further information: Osamu Tezuka's Star System note.

At least, bring it up at WT:MANGA, to see what they think.--Nohansen 14:31, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

I think I'll do just that. Thank you for the suggestion. OtakuMan 03:40, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Metropolis Cover-1.jpg

Image:Metropolis Cover-1.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 09:06, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Metropolis english manga.jpg

Image:Metropolis english manga.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 15:10, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Metropolis manga.jpg

Image:Metropolis manga.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 15:12, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Afterword

Coherency in section is lacking, and seems to take an editorial tone heralding the manga as seminal. The section as with the beginning seems quick to brush any issues stemming from the Fritz Lang film under the table. Who were the students and actual impact of the books production? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.222.5.106 (talk) 15:44, 6 August 2011 (UTC)